Please read the two excerpts from Sven Birkets’s “A Gatsby for Today: an enduringly relevant novel of acrid disillusion and resurgent hope” and comment on the class discussion page.
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Birkerts says, “Others, the true classics, survive the vagaries of the marketplace by tapping the status of the universal, embodying our essential dreams and conflicts”. I thought this was a good definition of classic books because the stories in classic books are still relevant even after years have gone by. For example the themes in the classic Huck Finn are still present today. Although we have made a lot of progress since the time the novel was written, the topic of racism still exists in America.
ReplyDeleteHe mentions “...A salesman got a dream, boy. It comes with territory.” and I think this connects very well with some top salespeople today. If you want to be successful, this comes at cost and in some cases one’s morality is sacrificed in the name of success and profit. If you want to be a top salesperson, you often have to be somewhat untruthful and cunning to sell more inventory to the public. As he says it’s a “bloody business”. A recent example of this is people selling medical supplies to the highest bidder during a pandemic. Although it is not necessarily right, there is a profit to be made and some salespeople are taking advantage of this opportunity.
ReplyDeleteI thought it was interesting that Birket thought that the books that "...must wait for changing cultural circumstances to give them point..." are not true classics, because they don't hold universal themes. I think that this is true, because in order for a book to be around for a long time and not fade in and out, it has to be both always applicable and relatively uncontroversial. So, although classic novels may be good, they're not significantly thought-provoking, and therefore not all they're made out to be.
ReplyDeleteHe mentioned how Gatsby is “not universal in the Shakespearean or Dantean sense, it is… perfectly American”. I interpret that as the book is able to be more relatable to the American people as it can be compared to what is going on in the present. It is a “cautionary tale” that readers can use the lessons they learn to help navigate their life, something that other books have trouble relating too. Excerpt 2 explains that the narrator is going to give us a valuable lesson about “wising up”, and I wonder what lesson the main character will learn and how he his moral development will grow, and will it be similar to Huck Finn?
ReplyDeleteBirkets writes that "Gatsby unfolds over the course of a long summer and follows the logic of a dream. One of the marvels of the book is the way in which the narration changes." So, this is suggesting that the main character is going to change and develop as the novel progress, and so will the narration of the novel.
ReplyDeleteI thought it was cool how they said that the description of the Buchanans’ house was “prose that had learned a few tricks from the movie camera” . I really see that with the way he describes the lawn in a way that mirrors a camera panning over the “leaping” turf. I had never thought of books being influenced by movies, only vice versa.
ReplyDeleteSomething I thought was interesting was when he said, "We do not have to work hard to connect to Fitzgerald's vision with the narrative of public life in our era- our Wall Street pirates, our stumping politicians looking for the light in the distance as they kick up the dust around their won suspect doings. Self-making is a bloody business. And Nick's awakening-- 'I wanted the world to be,,, at a sort of moral attention forever'-- is ours". I see this as a break down of what the author is attempting to portray.
ReplyDelete“To put it simply, the novel argues with itself, and does so just as we do with our own souls. It purports to speak of incidents and moral consequences, but underneath it is communicating something more ambiguous and suggestive”. I think it is important that books convey a message but don’t make it obvious so readers have to think about the underlying message. In Huckleberry Finn, one of the messages is that society is corrupt. The book itself doesn’t say that but it suggests it with the many instances Huck is in society (for example, the times Huck is with Tom, especially near the end).
ReplyDeleteYes! I'm reminded of what novelist Anthony Burgess said: 'It is not the novelist's job to preach; it is his duty to show.'
DeleteI love the way that Birkets describes how the novel will be when it comes to imagery. "It goes off like a flashbulb, freezing a bold array of images on the retina; the fade is delicious, stirring. This description of descriptions is very nice, but it also matches the example he picked form the book of the house. It really puts an "image of power" in your head as he describes and i can't wait to read more in the book.
ReplyDeleteEven though Huck Finn and Nick Carraway are both unreliable narrators, which will be more trustworthy for the reader? Huck is unreliable because of his young age; what will make Nick Carraway unreliable? Will the two boys be similar or polar opposites in their storytelling and messages?
ReplyDeleteBirkets states, "There is the tale, and there is the teller. And time and time again we are given clues that the teller, our collective mouthpiece, that stand-up decent fellow from the Midwest, does not quite believe the tale -- certainly not the lesson it would impart". Will we find out why Nick ultimately doesn't believe the tale? Does he experience a crisis of conscience just like Huck Finn did?
ReplyDeleteI like how Birkets explains that the Great Gatsby is "Thoroughly and perfectly American" and explains how it acts as a cautionary tale. I have never read the Great Gatsby and haven't watched the movie so Im pretty in the dark about the plot, which I think will make reading this book more fun!!
ReplyDeleteSimilar to Twain’s Huck Finn, Birkerts also establishes “The Great Gatsby” as a great or classic American novel. This made me wonder, what qualifies a novel or piece of work to be labeled as “great” or an “American classic.” Is it the style, tone, or time when the piece was composed?
ReplyDeleteI would like to preface this comment with a note that I have not read the book yet. It seems like our narrator might not be reliable but that is not necessarily bad. It might let us take more away from the book and make it more relatable. Also, a fully reliable narrator would have not forgotten that he gave away the ending of the book in the beginning. The unreliable narrator draws us in with the ending but lets us forget with him as the story progresses.
ReplyDeleteGreat point here, Camden! It reminds me of something the novelist David Lodge says in his excellent THE ART OF FICTION: "The point of using an unreliable narrator is indeed to reveal an interesting gap between appearance and reality, and to show how human beings distort or conceal the latter. This need not be a conscious, or mischievous, intention on their part."
DeleteI was intrigued by the description of a classic novel. Birkerts says that in order to be a classic, a novel "must perpetually renew its relevance for audiences". I agree with this statement, however, I feel that not every novel deemed a "classic" meets this standard. It begs the question, should all classics retain their titles as classics? Over the summer, I read Lolita as my "classic" summer reading novel. It's undeniable that Nabokov does a great job as a writer, but is the theme still relevant today? Should people be encouraged to read a book from the point of view of a child abuser as he justifies himself? I'm not saying the book should be taken off reading lists, I just believe that the theme is not very relevant and it might not be a "classic" in this day and age.
ReplyDeleteWhile reading excerpt one, I found it extremely satisfying when Birkets wrote "If the novel is not universal in the Shakespearean or Dantean sense, it is nevertheless thoroughly and perfectly American, a pure distillation of our collective experience"
ReplyDeleteBirkets' definition of a "classic" American novel places the most importance on continued relevance to society, but I think there are lots of novels we've read that are just as important now as when they were first written, yet we don't consider them to be classics. Noticeably, many of the American classics have an unreliable narrator, perhaps indicating that none of us really see reality from inside our own heads.
ReplyDeleteI thought it was interesting how Burkett’s said, “running behind or beneath the obvious legend is a second narrative, ... about dreaming. About the power of our expectations and our longings” and that this fact makes the Great Gatsby such a classic. Gatsby is able to not only have an interesting story full of “dirty dealings” but will also speak to everyone’s hopes and dreams.
ReplyDeleteI think its interesting how Birkets explained how it wont be hard to understand and make connections to contemporary life, but also will give you a new moral awakening. I think it will be interesting to see what that is and how we will see the development throughout the novel.
ReplyDeleteBirkets’ uses the term “classic” to describe the novel and I think it’s great how we get a snippet of how The Great Gatsby can be relatable to the other novels we have read. A lot of connections can be made.
ReplyDeleteBirkets’ uses the term “classic” to describe the novel and I think it’s great how we get a snippet of how The Great Gatsby can be relatable to the other novels we have read. A lot of connections can be made.
ReplyDeleteWhen Birkerts explained how novels become classics and said “to attain that status a novel - or a work in any genre - must perpetually renew its relevance for audiences” I think this a good point because people like reading and watching stories they can relate and connect to.
ReplyDeleteI found it interesting that Birkets views classic novels, as novels that have continued prevalence over time. This contrasted to my definition of a classic, which before reading these excerpts was just an older novel. However, after I read the excerpts I agreed with Birkets definition.
ReplyDeleteI think it was interesting to see how Sven Birkets explains what is a classic and what makes a book a classic. How it should be timeless and how it "must perpetually renew it s relevance for audiences". - Zoe Rigoulot
ReplyDeleteIt's extremely true that The Great Gatsby is a novel that argues with itself, one that is a contradiction without subtlety. Nick is the common man, the average person in Fitzgerald's eyes, which is why he claims the title of narrator. Like all average people, Nick has flaws, and that unreliable narration betrays a message behind the farce of the Jazz age. He is in love with the world of wealth and glamour, too stunned by the opulence to think any different until the night is over and the dreariness of the rest of his life sets in. We take that wonder and splendor and run with it, enjoying an Elysium of American culture, until the novel screeches to a halt, narrowly avoiding a brick wall only to go careening off the side of a cliff instead. Nick can now reflect, and in that reflection he is forced to acknowledge all the problems that were carefully and beautifully masked from him while he was involved in the society held up by the pillars of the American dream. Nick, and the reader, realizes that America and 20's culture is not about beauty and happiness. It is a personification of greed, power-hungriness, and an unquenchable thirst for validation. In my words and Birkets's, it is clear to see why this slim volume has reigned supreme as a true American classic for so long.
ReplyDeleteWhen Birkerts said, "The Great Gatsby has established itself as an American classic- more tellingly, as a classic that people actually read , and love", I had to rethink why classics were so revered by readers if they weren't wildly appealing to the masses. Do we revere classics because they are actually great pieces of work, or do we revere them because we are told that they are great? I feel like it certainly is a mixture of both. While there is no denying that the works of Shakespeare, Dante, and other classic authors are great, I feel like they are over glorified at times.
ReplyDeleteOne of my favorite responses to what you've posed about why classics are so revered is Italo Calvino's essay "Why Read the Classics?". A snippet of the essay is available here: https://www.nybooks.com/articles/1986/10/09/why-read-the-classics/
DeleteBirkerts idea that The Great Gatsby is "a pure distillation of our collective experience" reminds me a lot of Stan Lee saying that he wanted to make his character Spider-Man relatable by putting him in situations that most of us can relate to. I think relatability is part of what makes classic stories endure and is partly why we continue to love and read about these characters.
ReplyDeleteBirkert's explains that a for a novel to be able to be called a classic it must "perpetually renew it's relevance for audiences." While I definitely agree that that should be the case for a novel to be considered a classic, I don't think that's true for every novel. Many novels I've read that have been labeled as classics haven't felt particularly relevant. I hope that when I read The Great Gatsby I'll find that it lives up to the expectation of continuous relevance.
ReplyDeleteSimilar to many people in the class, I have no clue what Great Gasp by is truly about, but i could really understand how it is a "classic" as its impact on society can be seen today. Through our understanding of the time phrase from APUSH and just what we know about society at that time (and how that society is similar to our today) I'm excited to truly understand what resonates so much with audiences throughout time.
ReplyDeleteBirket's introduction stating Gatsby as an "American classic" made me ask myself, what is the criteria for an American classic? As Birket went on to explain why the novel is considered a classic, I still found difficulty in defining this term that I am so familiar with. An interesting point he made was about how a book's relevancy comes and goes as the world changes. Will the Great Gatsby prove to be relevant in our world today?
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ReplyDelete“Indeed, running behind or beneath the obvious legend is a secondary narrative, a narrative that is less about paying the piper than it is about dreaming.About the power of our expectations and our longings.” I think this is a really unique point of view/ analysis. It seems to touch on how the second narrative taps into the sort of subconscious mind and dreams and hopes.
Birkets's writing the novel high praise, and his description of its significance is quite interesting. His point about a section taking influence from filmmaking and movies is something I haven't heard before. It definitely sets the bar high in terms of my expectations of visual imagery. Birkets also praises the book in many other ways that I've never seen, like it being "perfectly American", or "arguing with itself". This example of an unreliable narrator seems much more tolerable than that of Huck, but I suppose we didn't get a gleaming introduction like Nick did in Birkets's writing.
ReplyDelete-Evan Bak
This review had me lost at thre beginning because it was boring but excerpt 2 got me hooked because he quoted on the waterfront. I just saw that movie and I swear I saw Marlon Brando sitting in the backseat with his brother say “I coulda been a contender” and I started paying attention. I decided I must read death of a salesmen because of its association with this quote. I liked his comments from here on out and can’t wait to read the novel.
ReplyDeleteOn that point I like the story of something that could have been. I always liked star wars episode 3 because I like to picture what anakin could have been if he didn’t turn to the dark side, Idk why. I also like the story about what will be. I’m not sure, maybe Gatsby is around that territory.
DeleteI am honestly really excited to read this book after Brikets calls this book an “American classic”. I think the main criteria for an American classic is to explore the universally common themes that creates connection between humans so they can relate to it. As this relevancy transcends time, it lives upto their expectations and makes them acknowledge that American classics are classics for a reason. I can’t wait to see how this book is going to grow on me?
ReplyDeleteI thought that Birket’s idea of a classic, “[something that can] survive the vagaries of the marketplace by tapping the status of the universal, embodying our essential dreams and conflicts”, encapsulates what I think defines a classic very well. For me, I think that a classic needs to be able to transcend time and always be relatable to new generations. The definition kind of reminds of the idea of a “living” constitution, where the law can be interpreted as fit for new generations, yet still demonstrate the core values of the document.
ReplyDeleteAs someone who has read the Great Gatsby, I completely agree with Birket stating that "... it is nevertheless perfectly and thoroughly American..." His connections to the supposed bliss of the 1920's and horrible realization of the limitations of the American dream is a lesson that has been experienced over and over again throughout American history. Often there will be a time where it feels as though America is a land where all is well and equal that is followed up by the expected consequences of such ignorant thought. Gatsby's cautionary tellings of the limits of the American dream and the supposed social mobility of it is the reason why I am inclined to agree with Brikets when he calls it a classic.
ReplyDelete- Seiyoung Jang
Birket says “as a classic people actually read, and love” I think this is interesting because first when he says classics it relates back to a bunch of literature we have already read so I bet there will be some connections throughout the novel and second that he says people will actually read it which is saying that some people actually don’t read them which he notices but this one is different so I’m excited to see how so.
ReplyDeleteBirket says “as a classic people actually read, and love” I think this is interesting because first when he says classics it relates back to a bunch of literature we have already read so I bet there will be some connections throughout the novel and second that he says people will actually read it which is saying that some people actually don’t read them which he notices but this one is different so I’m excited to see how so.
ReplyDeleteBirkets states that for some books to become classics, "Some books must wait for changing cultural circumstances to give them a poin." I agree with this and I think that it can be seen in multiple classics we have read.
ReplyDelete-Raphael Thesmar
DeleteBirkets claims, “Some books must wait for changing cultural circumstances to give them point; they go in and out of print as the incalculable mood of the general readership dictates”. When I first read this, I considered those books that must wait for change in cultural circumstances were similar to how certain issues in society are only addressed when its applies mainstream, often overlooked otherwise.
ReplyDeleteBirkets says that in order for a novel to be considered a classic it must renew its relevance. I agree with this statement because I think that in order for a novel to be relevant to in new generations, there has to be a part of it that resonates with people today and or relates to a on going theme in today’s world.
ReplyDeleteI think the themes Birkets mentioned about rise and fall and its relevance to the 1980s are interesting. I am not very familiar with either period of time but I think it will be interesting to relate The Great Gatsby to modern times, especially if, as Birkets claims, will tap into perennial conflicts and cautions.
ReplyDeleteOliver
DeleteWhen Birkets talks about how the book is a "classic" and it was first published in 1925, thats insane to think about because I know there was a movie made about it only a couple years ago that seemed to cause a big talk because of how many people went to see it, definitely is the definition of the word "classic"
ReplyDeleteI read it at camp when I finally ran out of things to read and a counselor lent it to me. I remember that he had liked it so much that he had stolen a copy from his school library, and he fiercely recommended it to me, a rising 8th?, maybe 9th grader at the time. I still liked it. It's one of those books that manage to be enjoyable and impart an important message but also not be super preachy. It's rather tragic, but it's poetic and artsy and a little romantic and the narrator is decent (I like him most out of all the characters). It has something for everyone: social commentary, romance, moral and personal crises, a bit of humour; that is probably why it's so well loved. And even if you read it not paying need to the message, as I did, it still subtly hits you over the head with it.
ReplyDelete-Alicia
I am ready to read this book. I love the line where Birkets talks about how the book argues with itself. Those tend to be the best books to read, the ones which decidedly contradict and mess with itself in an effort to get the reader to determine their own view on a subject. The books that don't have clear answers wop life are the ones that I think a lot of people are stumped by, as many people would like the clear cut answer to any sort of problem, but I can't really stand those books. They almost seem stuffy to me, where the author is trying to shove ideas into your face in an effort to force feed them to you. Contrastingly, books which inherently contradict or offer up another antiparallel argument draw me in.
ReplyDelete- Cameron
I've read this book before! The content of the book fascinates me. I'm aware that it's supposed to be a commentary against jazz age extravagance and hedonism but it's one of those books that just makes the environment seem more enticing. The novel is a classic because it catches the immortal American enthrallment with excess. The obsession with wealth and status from the 1920s lives on today and it leaves people stranded now just as it does with Nick Carraway.
ReplyDeleteI think it will be interesting to read this book in this time period, as I have recently heard a lot of connections being made between 2020 and the roaring 20s. Epidemics, crashing economies and the push for social change connect these two decades and I will be interested to see if I can find any more connections while reading the Great Gatsby.
ReplyDeleteI find the quote "Whenever you feel like criticizing any one... just remember that all the people in this world haven't had the advantages you've had" interesting, as I feel it aligns closely with real life (in the US), since it is easy for us to think that we are not privileged or given advantages while being unaware that there are a lot of people below us (of which that amount of people has probably been increasing over the last month or so).
ReplyDeleteBirkerts says (paraphrasing) that The Great Gatsby is a classic, and specifically an ever-relevant American classic. I think the reason for this is because as a country we are absolutely obsessed with aesthetics and we have been for a while (look at our popular music, beauty culture, social media, cultural imagination, reality television, slang words like flex, boujee etc), and TGG appeals to that with its literary style as Birkets points out, as well as in its plot. As Americans we are constantly surrounded by advertisements of a life we are being told we want, and a consequence of this is that we see wealth as aspirational and a signifier of success to such an extent that part of what it means to be American is a desire to at least occasionally feel like we live luxuriously, hence we read books like TGG. Even things we see as empowering to those most often excluded from wealth really just derive their qualities from the same unquestioned power sources that caused them to be excluded in the first place (look at pop feminism, hip-hop hedonism, rags to riches narratives in general). This is evidence of what I think Birkerts means when he writes that classics like TGG "survive the vagaries of the marketplace by tapping the stratum of the universal, embodying our essential dreams and conflicts." On a similar note, maybe this book has cemented itself as an American classic is because after it lures us in with its opulent descriptions of things we deeply yearn for, it also offers critiques of opulence and wealth, making us feel better about our lack of thereof.
ReplyDelete-Jona Lehmann
Deletesorry about the typos, I should have reread before posting
DeleteIts interesting that the novel examines the glorification of overindulgence in the 20s. I think disillusionment with what is supposed to be the image of success (in this case the American dream) is a very powerful theme that takes great skill to deliver. The juxtaposition of dreams and the immoral actions taken to achieve them is almost dystopian as it exposes reality of a seemingly perfect thing.
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